Bell raises the bar... - ZX6R Forum
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post #1 of 28 Old 06-20-2016, 05:18 AM Thread Starter
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Bell raises the bar...

This is the next improvement in helmet design..... should reduce concussions a bunch.

Bell Helmets Introduces MIPS Impact Technology to Increase Safety in Helmets | Sport Rider

"There's this adage that we have 2 ears and one mouth so we should listen twice as much as we talk. Unfortunately with the Internet people have taken this old adage and turned it around. They have two eyes and 10 fingers so they think they need to post 5 times as much as they read. And since they have 10 fingers and one brain, they only have to think 10% of the time! "
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post #2 of 28 Old 06-20-2016, 05:32 AM
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Interesting. I've got a Moto 9 Flex. I'm a bit surprised to see them using MIPS after spending the money to develop Flex. Not sure how much it's going to help street riders though. The velocities in an average street fall are so much higher than the average off-road fall I'm not sure the biggest issue is rotational forces. Don't get me wrong, more protection is better I just don't know that it would be a primary selling point in a street helmet for me.

Just for the record, MIPS has been around for a few years now.
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post #3 of 28 Old 06-20-2016, 05:37 AM
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I've always loved bell helmets, glad they keep getting better and better!

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post #4 of 28 Old 06-20-2016, 06:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NatBrown View Post
Interesting. I've got a Moto 9 Flex. I'm a bit surprised to see them using MIPS after spending the money to develop Flex. Not sure how much it's going to help street riders though. The velocities in an average street fall are so much higher than the average off-road fall I'm not sure the biggest issue is rotational forces. Don't get me wrong, more protection is better I just don't know that it would be a primary selling point in a street helmet for me.

Just for the record, MIPS has been around for a few years now.
I too am a bit surprised by this since the same Flex technology that they use in the Moto9 is what is coming out in the Race Star and Pro Star in August. I am sure that cost of manufacturing comes into play here as the DLX is a much less expensive lid but it should absolutely offer more protection than the standard EPS foam liner in all the other helmets.
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post #5 of 28 Old 06-20-2016, 07:58 AM
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What's the difference between this and the Flex tech? It sounds like MIPS is cheaper, single layer of protection, while Flex is 3 layers, their premium protection.

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post #6 of 28 Old 06-20-2016, 08:14 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NatBrown View Post
Interesting. I've got a Moto 9 Flex. I'm a bit surprised to see them using MIPS after spending the money to develop Flex. Not sure how much it's going to help street riders though. The velocities in an average street fall are so much higher than the average off-road fall I'm not sure the biggest issue is rotational forces. Don't get me wrong, more protection is better I just don't know that it would be a primary selling point in a street helmet for me.

Just for the record, MIPS has been around for a few years now.
Considering I seem Moto X guys biting dirt at 30+ MPH..... I don't see a big chance in the momentum that the rider's head hits the surface with. A helmet going from 0-30+ MPH is going to produce a LOT of rotational force on the brain.... a slicker skin on the helmet, and some ability to let the shell rotate before the lining has it is only going to reduce the number of concussions.

This stuff needs to be in place in football helmets, ASAP. Same with skiing helmets.... heck, even bicycle helmets would benefit from this. Horse riding helmets, too.

Hockey is already so f'd up, I don't thik it would help there.
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"There's this adage that we have 2 ears and one mouth so we should listen twice as much as we talk. Unfortunately with the Internet people have taken this old adage and turned it around. They have two eyes and 10 fingers so they think they need to post 5 times as much as they read. And since they have 10 fingers and one brain, they only have to think 10% of the time! "
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post #7 of 28 Old 06-20-2016, 08:15 AM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by commiehunter View Post
What's the difference between this and the Flex tech? It sounds like MIPS is cheaper, single layer of protection, while Flex is 3 layers, their premium protection.
^^ this, I would like to know as well.....

"There's this adage that we have 2 ears and one mouth so we should listen twice as much as we talk. Unfortunately with the Internet people have taken this old adage and turned it around. They have two eyes and 10 fingers so they think they need to post 5 times as much as they read. And since they have 10 fingers and one brain, they only have to think 10% of the time! "
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post #8 of 28 Old 06-20-2016, 09:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by commiehunter View Post
What's the difference between this and the Flex tech? It sounds like MIPS is cheaper, single layer of protection, while Flex is 3 layers, their premium protection.
Mips is a less expensive, and somewhat less effective method for absorbing and deflecting kinetic impact before it reaches the brain (which is what causes concussions). Here is a video for MIPS for Bell bicycle helmets which I assume is the same technology adapted for their motorcycle lids. As soon as I get an official video/release on the MIPS for MC helmets I will post it here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMWKHoVlgYE

The Flex technology is several steps above MIPS. Three layers of different density foam is designed to compress at different rates, substantially further reducing head trauma. Additionally, each layer is bonded with material that is designed to shift with glancing blows/side impact which reduces torsional impacts (twists) on the head...it is the sloshing effect of the brain that causes concussions so this is a huge step in actual concussion prevention technology.

This is a video for the Moto9 Flex dirt helmet, which goes into a lot of detail on the Flex liner which is the same for the street lids

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8iEfhKqz0Q

and a good writeup on Jalopnik
This New Bell Helmet Is The Most Important Street Helmet In The Past 50 Years

These are due to arrive August 1 and I can't wait!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RJ2112 View Post
Considering I seem Moto X guys biting dirt at 30+ MPH..... I don't see a big chance in the momentum that the rider's head hits the surface with. A helmet going from 0-30+ MPH is going to produce a LOT of rotational force on the brain.... a slicker skin on the helmet, and some ability to let the shell rotate before the lining has it is only going to reduce the number of concussions.

This stuff needs to be in place in football helmets, ASAP. Same with skiing helmets.... heck, even bicycle helmets would benefit from this. Horse riding helmets, too.

Hockey is already so f'd up, I don't thik it would help there.
Interestingly enough, this tech came out of Blackburn...a sister company to Bell and the provider of almost all of the professional football helmets out there.
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post #9 of 28 Old 06-22-2016, 02:04 AM Thread Starter
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Just saw this article..... 6D ODS haven't had a chance to read all the way through it; but I do like where this is going.

"There's this adage that we have 2 ears and one mouth so we should listen twice as much as we talk. Unfortunately with the Internet people have taken this old adage and turned it around. They have two eyes and 10 fingers so they think they need to post 5 times as much as they read. And since they have 10 fingers and one brain, they only have to think 10% of the time! "
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post #10 of 28 Old 06-22-2016, 04:58 AM
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Nice. I liked the 6D concept in the MX helmets. The only real drawback to it I've seen is the size of the helmets. They are huge compared to other helmets. Which means they are heavy too.

Hadn't seen they had a street helmet out yet. I really like the looks of it. I would for sure consider it when buying a new helmet.
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post #11 of 28 Old 06-22-2016, 05:24 AM
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Also, one thing to clarify.

MIPS deals only with torsional impact (twisting), FLEX deals with that plus lots of extra standard kinetic impact protection.
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post #12 of 28 Old 06-23-2016, 10:55 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PainfullySlo View Post
Also, one thing to clarify.

MIPS deals only with torsional impact (twisting), FLEX deals with that plus lots of extra standard kinetic impact protection.
It all comes down to how well you want to protect the rider's brain. more padding, more distance, softer padding, less twisting -- all off that reduces the
accelerations applied to the brain.

how big can you allow that to become?

I have seen comparisons of consistency between a 20-something's brain and tapioca pudding. The older you get the more stiff the connections become -- 'hard headed' is really a thing. It's just inside your head

The initial Snell standard was designed to protect racecar drivers from whacking their heads on the roll cages of their cars. Because the hits could occur in the same place repeatedly the padding had to be quite stiff to protect the skull from that impact.

It was already understood that the # of Gee allowed in that scenario were too high for a healthy brain.

The DOT allowed far less Gee, in their medically based guidance. That requires softer foam, and more of it to allow the liner to crush more gradually.... that spreads the load out over time. deltaV, over delta t.

The newest Snell standard matches the euro requirements, which come very close to matching the initial DOT numbers.

If these technologies are allowing lower number of gee than any of these standards, that can only be a good thing for brain health.
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"There's this adage that we have 2 ears and one mouth so we should listen twice as much as we talk. Unfortunately with the Internet people have taken this old adage and turned it around. They have two eyes and 10 fingers so they think they need to post 5 times as much as they read. And since they have 10 fingers and one brain, they only have to think 10% of the time! "
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post #13 of 28 Old 06-23-2016, 01:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RJ2112 View Post
It all comes down to how well you want to protect the rider's brain. more padding, more distance, softer padding, less twisting -- all off that reduces the
accelerations applied to the brain.

how big can you allow that to become?

I have seen comparisons of consistency between a 20-something's brain and tapioca pudding. The older you get the more stiff the connections become -- 'hard headed' is really a thing. It's just inside your head

The initial Snell standard was designed to protect racecar drivers from whacking their heads on the roll cages of their cars. Because the hits could occur in the same place repeatedly the padding had to be quite stiff to protect the skull from that impact.

It was already understood that the # of Gee allowed in that scenario were too high for a healthy brain.

The DOT allowed far less Gee, in their medically based guidance. That requires softer foam, and more of it to allow the liner to crush more gradually.... that spreads the load out over time. deltaV, over delta t.

The newest Snell standard matches the euro requirements, which come very close to matching the initial DOT numbers.

If these technologies are allowing lower number of gee than any of these standards, that can only be a good thing for brain health.
BAM! Knowledgebomb!
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post #14 of 28 Old 12-24-2016, 12:18 PM
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Bell Star helmets are AWESOME.... however good luck getting replacement liners/parts in about a year or two.
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post #15 of 28 Old 12-25-2016, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by JakeWA13636 View Post
Bell Star helmets are AWESOME.... however good luck getting replacement liners/parts in about a year or two.
Glad that you are a fan of Bell. I have been rocking the Race Star for most of this past season and love it.

Not sure why you think finding parts would be difficult however. *shrugs*
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