Any hope of EBR's return is done for... - Page 2 - ZX6R Forum
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post #16 of 58 Old 01-22-2016, 08:24 AM
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Let's just face the facts, Americans can't build a competitive sport bike, there I said it.
Sure we can. We just don't want to pay for it.

Similar to saying Americans can't build a competitive phone. It's not that Slave Children in southeast Asia are especially good at electronics manufacturing...
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post #17 of 58 Old 01-22-2016, 08:26 AM
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Sure we can. We just don't want to pay for it.

Similar to saying Americans can't build a competitive phone. It's not that Slave Children in southeast Asia are especially good at electronics manufacturing...
The EBR was what $40K? And it was never competitive.


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post #18 of 58 Old 01-22-2016, 08:31 AM
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Saw it the other day. Sad news. I always wanted to purchase a xb9r or xb12r, then Buell went under. I saw some hope with EBR but, once again, the company dissolved. They were ugly bikes, but I loved the old V-twin engine platform.
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post #19 of 58 Old 01-22-2016, 08:37 AM
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Originally Posted by EvilTwin View Post
The EBR was what $40K? And it was never competitive.
I thought the "Civilian" one was around the same cost as an S1000 (which, yes, is a problem, since it was a new player).

But that's not my point. My point is that they entered WSBK as a new manufacturer (playing against companies with multi-decade pedigrees) and scored championship points. Personally, I don't think they were around long enough to make the call about whether they could be competitive.

It's a big leap from "EBR is folding" to "Americans can't build a competitive sportbike." We can, it's just expensive! The market is saturated with cheaper, proven options, and no one is going to have the brand clout of Harley Davidson.

I think it would be difficult for any new player to enter the market. Kind of a scary situation actually.

Edit: To put it another way, the Corvette frequently dominates at LeMans. Regardless of that, try to imagine a new automobile company starting up in the U.S., right now.


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"im not into riding curves and ish man and yall getting crazy chillout i want ur opinions but dont call me a squid i no alot about
zukis maybe not as much as yall but deff not comparable to a squid w.e yall say buttt" - Benjamin Franklin, Esq.

Last edited by Venge; 01-22-2016 at 08:41 AM.
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post #20 of 58 Old 01-22-2016, 09:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Venge View Post
I thought the "Civilian" one was around the same cost as an S1000 (which, yes, is a problem, since it was a new player).

But that's not my point. My point is that they entered WSBK as a new manufacturer (playing against companies with multi-decade pedigrees) and scored championship points. Personally, I don't think they were around long enough to make the call about whether they could be competitive.

It's a big leap from "EBR is folding" to "Americans can't build a competitive sportbike." We can, it's just expensive! The market is saturated with cheaper, proven options, and no one is going to have the brand clout of Harley Davidson.

I think it would be difficult for any new player to enter the market. Kind of a scary situation actually.

Edit: To put it another way, the Corvette frequently dominates at LeMans. Regardless of that, try to imagine a new automobile company starting up in the U.S., right now.

So how are European companies like Vryus, Suter and Kalex able to do it
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post #21 of 58 Old 01-22-2016, 09:34 AM
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So how are European companies like Vryus, Suter and Kalex able to do it
I was trying to figure out why I had never heard of any of these ...

Luxury brands have succeeded. Boss Hoss started in 1990 and sells exactly what people want to buy. Your examples are luxury and racing constructors - fair enough, and companies like Saleen did similar things in the US, as have Brammo, Zero, and other little shops.

Look up the story of MotoCzysz, who kind of got the shaft during their attempt at being a racing constructor. I'm saying imagine a mainstream player entering the market, not some one-off constructor. The companies you listed are not that.


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"im not into riding curves and ish man and yall getting crazy chillout i want ur opinions but dont call me a squid i no alot about
zukis maybe not as much as yall but deff not comparable to a squid w.e yall say buttt" - Benjamin Franklin, Esq.
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post #22 of 58 Old 01-22-2016, 10:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Venge View Post
I was trying to figure out why I had never heard of any of these ...

Luxury brands have succeeded. Boss Hoss started in 1990 and sells exactly what people want to buy. Your examples are luxury and racing constructors - fair enough, and companies like Saleen did similar things in the US, as have Brammo, Zero, and other little shops.

Look up the story of MotoCzysz, who kind of got the shaft during their attempt at being a racing constructor. I'm saying imagine a mainstream player entering the market, not some one-off constructor. The companies you listed are not that.
Spot on... that MotoCsysz was a vastly superior bike to anything EBR has put out in the last 2 decades. And still couldn't gain enough traction to stick around. That was a beautifully designed and well thought out machine too. But costly to produce in such small numbers.

The bigger manufacturers are able to produce new bikes simply because they can make up the difference in a los leader in other bikes that sell. Honda is a perfect example of a brand that puts out some weird concept hoping it'll stick. Deep pockets help.

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post #23 of 58 Old 01-22-2016, 11:05 AM Thread Starter
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Spot on... that MotoCsysz was a vastly superior bike to anything EBR has put out in the last 2 decades. And still couldn't gain enough traction to stick around. That was a beautifully designed and well thought out machine too. But costly to produce in such small numbers.

The bigger manufacturers are able to produce new bikes simply because they can make up the difference in a los leader in other bikes that sell. Honda is a perfect example of a brand that puts out some weird concept hoping it'll stick. Deep pockets help.
Is that guy still alive? i tried googling him but havent been able to find an update on him.

Don't be stupid.
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post #24 of 58 Old 01-22-2016, 11:36 AM
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I know Michael Csysz has been fighting cancer. Not up on much more than that with him. Amazing designer and engineer though.

His bikes have done pretty damn well in the IOMTT over the last few years though.
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post #25 of 58 Old 01-22-2016, 11:42 AM Thread Starter
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Yeah the article rose shared a long time ago is basically the last update that i know of:

Motorcycle Therapy: The Michael Czysz Story

off topic but who gives a shit, its an awesome read
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post #26 of 58 Old 01-22-2016, 11:58 AM
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Don't worry guys, when I win the lottery I'll start up an American brand.

Kinda sucks that it happened again but it seemed almost inevitable.
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post #27 of 58 Old 01-29-2016, 03:57 PM
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EBR Parts Available For Sale, Motorcycle Production Could Restart In March...If A New Buyer Can Be Found

Another update. Looks like there is still some hope. I admire Erik Buell's persistence.
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post #28 of 58 Old 01-29-2016, 06:03 PM
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EBR Parts Available For Sale, Motorcycle Production Could Restart In March...If A New Buyer Can Be Found

Another update. Looks like there is still some hope. I admire Erik Buell's persistence.
America needs a sportbike! Motorcycle are as American as pizza or Apple pie.... Not sure what happened in the 70's /80's when the first "sport" motorcycles were being imported. I hope we finally get one that is able to compete.

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post #29 of 58 Old 01-29-2016, 06:26 PM
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America needs a sportbike! Motorcycle are as American as pizza or Apple pie.... Not sure what happened in the 70's /80's when the first "sport" motorcycles were being imported. I hope we finally get one that is able to compete.
Ummm why...

Why does America need a sportbike?

Pizza is not American there Mr Trump...

Do you really believe an American company will be able to produce a sportbike comparable in price and performance to any of the European much less Japanesse producers at this point?
If you do I have a bridge and some swamp land in Florida I'd like to sell you.
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post #30 of 58 Old 01-29-2016, 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted by smokey11 View Post
Ummm why...

Why does America need a sportbike?

Pizza is not American there Mr Trump...

Do you really believe an American company will be able to produce a sportbike comparable in price and performance to any of the European much less Japanesse producers at this point?
If you do I have a bridge and some swamp land in Florida I'd like to sell you.
. Who cares dude. For the most part motorcycle enthusiasts are known to welcome diversity of different engines, makes, models and technology. I personally loved the sound of the EBR and would welcome further development.

On a different note, who wouldn't kill to have a Britten V1000? Affordable or attainable? Absolutely not, but innovators make those classics happen.

Lighten up.
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