Brakes locked up, went down today. - Page 3 - ZX6R Forum
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post #31 of 57 Old 11-16-2015, 03:52 PM
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Is that too much fluid in the Reservoir? You don't manually control the amount of fluid in the cylinder, unless I'm crazy.

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Originally Posted by PainfullySlo View Post
Hydraulic lock from overfilled master cylinder. A very common, and entirely avoidable, mistake.
I might be crazy even so.

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post #32 of 57 Old 11-16-2015, 08:08 PM
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Originally Posted by PainfullySlo View Post
Hydraulic lock from overfilled master cylinder. A very common, and entirely avoidable, mistake.
Pardon my ignorance but I'd like to verify that this has not occurred on my motorcycle.

Does overfilling the fluid reservoir cause overfilling of the master cylinder? Or is that entire assembly considered the master cylinder?

I think I'm good as my reservoir is not overfilled...

Thanks!
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post #33 of 57 Old 11-16-2015, 08:22 PM
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So glad your here to talk about it and thrilled it wasn't worse.
Imagine you will be sore for a couple of days, you have to figure out what caused the crash.
Would be going over the brake system with a fine tooth comb.

Please let us know what you find.
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post #34 of 57 Old 11-17-2015, 09:26 AM
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Hydraulic lock happens on front brakes of motorcyles like this:

Brake reservoir gets overfilled. Brakes seem fine cold.

As you ride and use your brakes, the brake fluid heats and expands until the reservoir is full. Once full, that pressure has to go somewhere.

The only other moving part in the system are the pistons in your brake calipers, which begin moving outward (towards the rotors) to relieve the pressure building up. This causes your pads to contact the rotors which, in turn, creates more heat, and more fluid expansion. Things escalate very quickly from here.

Very quickly the pressure becomes enough that it is forcing the pads against your rotors with significant force...and down you go.

This would be why there is a 'max fill' line on your brake reservoir, and if you have ever looked at a set up track or race bike, the fluid is usually right about the 'minimum fluid' line to allow for the most expansion.

I saw at a track day a brand spanking new RC8R...the factory race bike...with 35 miles go down this way. The guy decided he wanted a different master cylinder, did the work himself, and overfilled the reservoir. I had to pick up his bike from a ditch and couldnt roll it until I opened the brake reservoir...
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post #35 of 57 Old 11-17-2015, 09:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PainfullySlo View Post
Hydraulic lock happens on front brakes of motorcyles like this:

Brake reservoir gets overfilled. Brakes seem fine cold.

As you ride and use your brakes, the brake fluid heats and expands until the reservoir is full. Once full, that pressure has to go somewhere.

The only other moving part in the system are the pistons in your brake calipers, which begin moving outward (towards the rotors) to relieve the pressure building up. This causes your pads to contact the rotors which, in turn, creates more heat, and more fluid expansion. Things escalate very quickly from here.

Very quickly the pressure becomes enough that it is forcing the pads against your rotors with significant force...and down you go.

This would be why there is a 'max fill' line on your brake reservoir, and if you have ever looked at a set up track or race bike, the fluid is usually right about the 'minimum fluid' line to allow for the most expansion.

I saw at a track day a brand spanking new RC8R...the factory race bike...with 35 miles go down this way. The guy decided he wanted a different master cylinder, did the work himself, and overfilled the reservoir. I had to pick up his bike from a ditch and couldnt roll it until I opened the brake reservoir...
Learned something new! Thanks
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post #36 of 57 Old 11-17-2015, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PainfullySlo View Post
Hydraulic lock happens on front brakes of motorcyles like this:

Brake reservoir gets overfilled. Brakes seem fine cold.

As you ride and use your brakes, the brake fluid heats and expands until the reservoir is full. Once full, that pressure has to go somewhere.

The only other moving part in the system are the pistons in your brake calipers, which begin moving outward (towards the rotors) to relieve the pressure building up. This causes your pads to contact the rotors which, in turn, creates more heat, and more fluid expansion. Things escalate very quickly from here.

Very quickly the pressure becomes enough that it is forcing the pads against your rotors with significant force...and down you go.

This would be why there is a 'max fill' line on your brake reservoir, and if you have ever looked at a set up track or race bike, the fluid is usually right about the 'minimum fluid' line to allow for the most expansion.

I saw at a track day a brand spanking new RC8R...the factory race bike...with 35 miles go down this way. The guy decided he wanted a different master cylinder, did the work himself, and overfilled the reservoir. I had to pick up his bike from a ditch and couldnt roll it until I opened the brake reservoir...
Sounds like a good way to painfullyslo



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post #37 of 57 Old 11-17-2015, 06:44 PM
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Sounds like a good way to painfullyslo



LOL..OUCH! That was terrible :-p
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post #38 of 57 Old 11-17-2015, 11:58 PM
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Thank you for the great explanation!
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post #39 of 57 Old 11-18-2015, 06:27 AM
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OP said he had to break bleeder loose to get the pistons to compress before he could get the pads in far enough to clear the rotor. I would have stopped and rebuilt or replaced caliper at that point. If you have to break bleeder to get pistons to compress you have an issue. Glad you are okay and had gear on.

Dude.....you're about to get roasted. You pour soul
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post #40 of 57 Old 03-18-2016, 12:08 AM
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Hey, I had the same thing happen to me the other day, but mine was 15 mph. I have almost the exact situation too, new ss brake lines, front brake locked up after riding for 10 minutes. Is the problem a faulty master cylinder?
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post #41 of 57 Old 03-18-2016, 07:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Watsona1 View Post
Hey, I had the same thing happen to me the other day, but mine was 15 mph. I have almost the exact situation too, new ss brake lines, front brake locked up after riding for 10 minutes. Is the problem a faulty master cylinder?
The whole idea of this post was to point out the need to not overfill the brake fluid reservoir. The brake fluid needs room to expand, or else it locks up.
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post #42 of 57 Old 03-18-2016, 09:04 AM
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What year is you bike? Also like everyone else have said dont overfill the brake res.
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post #43 of 57 Old 03-18-2016, 09:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PainfullySlo View Post
Hydraulic lock happens on front brakes of motorcyles like this:

Brake reservoir gets overfilled. Brakes seem fine cold.

As you ride and use your brakes, the brake fluid heats and expands until the reservoir is full. Once full, that pressure has to go somewhere.

The only other moving part in the system are the pistons in your brake calipers, which begin moving outward (towards the rotors) to relieve the pressure building up. This causes your pads to contact the rotors which, in turn, creates more heat, and more fluid expansion. Things escalate very quickly from here.

Very quickly the pressure becomes enough that it is forcing the pads against your rotors with significant force...and down you go.

This would be why there is a 'max fill' line on your brake reservoir, and if you have ever looked at a set up track or race bike, the fluid is usually right about the 'minimum fluid' line to allow for the most expansion.

I saw at a track day a brand spanking new RC8R...the factory race bike...with 35 miles go down this way. The guy decided he wanted a different master cylinder, did the work himself, and overfilled the reservoir. I had to pick up his bike from a ditch and couldnt roll it until I opened the brake reservoir...
Just curious...would ABS prevent this or would the pressure override the system?
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post #44 of 57 Old 03-18-2016, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KawiDude View Post
Just curious...would ABS prevent this or would the pressure override the system?
Pressure would override the system. ABS only works if the regular mechanical functions of your braking system are working. Hydraulic lock prevents that.

Sadly this is entirely preventable and I see it happen often on our bikes for 2 reasons:
  1. Overfull brake reservoir. Fluid expands as it heats and needs to have somewhere to go. If not, it applies your brakes until you crash
  2. Improperly installed brake lever. Our master cylinders have a pin that goes into a recessed hole inside the brake lever. I have seen people not get the pin seated properly which does the same thing, it is essentially slightly applying the brakes all the time, causing the fluid to overheat and the same thing happens. Hydraulic lock.
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post #45 of 57 Old 12-16-2016, 06:56 AM
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Crazy stuff hope that never happens to me... Never heard of the 05-06 ZX6R having brake issues, thought it was manly the GSXR's that had that problem. Best of luck with recovery

P.S

Curious found some frame sliders today wondering if anyone has seen or heard of them...

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/Sale...08.4.14.0SdSMi

There for my 2006 ZX6R found them on Ali Express for just under $60 dollars. What caught my eye was the look of them, not the traditional plastic spindle that sticks out the side of the fairing. However don't know how well they'll hold up or what the quality's like No feedback on the site although the seller has 97% positive feedback.
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