Stalling issue on 2006 Zx6r - at stop lights, TPS? Throttle body? - ZX6R Forum
 
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post #1 of 7 Old 01-11-2017, 01:22 PM Thread Starter
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Stalling issue on 2006 Zx6r - at stop lights, TPS? Throttle body?

Problem - Bike dying randomly at stoplights and being REALLY hard to get started again.

Called a tow truck last night after spending quite a while trying to get the dumb thing started. The starter motor would go and the battery was plenty strong, but it just wouldn't kick or even cough/spit much. While the tow truck was coming i gave it af ew more shots, and by turning the throttle nearly completely open got it to cough and eventually start. It did not want to hold an idle at most lights; no issues at all (Even at low rpms, just off idle) once moving though.

Some background
a) I've been dealing with a hestitation on upshifts for almost 2 years. Roughly 5000-6000rpm, there is a massive stumble, and the bike rides more or less normal above that. Very irritating but I've been dealing with it.

I've taken it to both local and a Kawasaki dealer to try to fix it, to no avail. After 2 tries with the dealer, they came to the conclusion that it is related to the throttle body. They don't cite much evidence, and having them install a new one costs more than the bike is worth.

That said, independently I had previously thought the throttle position sensor might be the issue. The hestitation seems related to me moving the throttle without much effect. Based on reading this AM, the throttle position sensor and throttle body are kind of one and the same.

b) THis same Kawasaki dealer did a service on the bike (valve adjustment, plugs, basic tune up) about 500 miles ago, the last time I had it in to try to figure out the hesitation. Other than the hesitation not being fixed, the bike has run fine.

HOWEVER - there has been a low idle speed since the service. Previously i had just thought they moved the idle speed screw a bit, and slowed the idle, but i'm now thinking its related.

c) Its been very rainy the last few days, when the problem emerged. The bike has been rained on a bit. Drying the bike out hasn't seemed to help a ton though.

What do I do? COuld the TPS be at fault? What goes into adjusting/fixing/replacing that? (searches suggest its complicated)

I could see it being a vacuum leak. Any really common areas and/or hoses to replace to eliminate that? Anything else? Fuel pump?

Thanks!
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post #2 of 7 Old 01-11-2017, 02:00 PM
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Quote:
HOWEVER - there has been a low idle speed since the service. Previously i had just thought they moved the idle speed screw a bit, and slowed the idle, but i'm now thinking its related.
Was this a typo? You thought there was a low idle speed so you slowed down the idle Should be the other way around. Raise the idle.

Any info on what your mechanics actually checked?

I've heard other Kawi owners complain about hesitation around that RPM range. Might not be as abnormal as you think.

Don't consider a battery good if its older than 2 years even if it tests within parameters.

Other than that I'm stumped. I imagine while doing your service they would've discovered any obvious problems with the engine. So I'm leaning electrical as the source of your problems. Check wiring harnesses for shorts?

You should take it to another reputable mechanic that doesn't work at a dealership. Have him test drive it. If he can't duplicate the problem and express to you his plan to diagnose it, take it to someone else.
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post #3 of 7 Old 01-11-2017, 02:44 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RedAndBlack View Post
Was this a typo? You thought there was a low idle speed so you slowed down the idle Should be the other way around. Raise the idle.

Any info on what your mechanics actually checked?

I've heard other Kawi owners complain about hesitation around that RPM range. Might not be as abnormal as you think.

Don't consider a battery good if its older than 2 years even if it tests within parameters.

Other than that I'm stumped. I imagine while doing your service they would've discovered any obvious problems with the engine. So I'm leaning electrical as the source of your problems. Check wiring harnesses for shorts?

You should take it to another reputable mechanic that doesn't work at a dealership. Have him test drive it. If he can't duplicate the problem and express to you his plan to diagnose it, take it to someone else.
Not a clear sentence. I noticed the idle speed wa sa little lower when i got it back. I assumed it was some setting the shop made during the service; i never touched anything.

I was planning to bump up the idle on my own this weekend, but at this time have not.

Perhaps another kawasaki dealer/shop is the best. Experiences at dealers so far has been lackluster to be sure.
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post #4 of 7 Old 01-12-2017, 10:09 AM
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Bump up the idle. I had a similar issue when I pulled the tb and added a PCV the other day. Between the two and probably adjusting the idle accidentally it has symptoms similar to yours.

As far as a massive stumble, every single kawi I've owned has a stumble around there without tuning. 250, ZX7, my 6r.

-------------
06 ZX6R - Vortex Rearset, GPR V1, Driven Clipons (soon), Secondary Butterflies removed (may revert), PCV, Micron Serpent Headers/Midpipe (soon), MotionPro Throttle
03 EX250 - Wife's current whip
98 ZX6E - Basket case at the moment

WTB: Dynojet Autotune w/ sensor
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post #5 of 7 Old 01-12-2017, 04:06 PM Thread Starter
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interesting.

would a power commander potentially address that? (ok, the correct answer is probably to stop throwing money at it)
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post #6 of 7 Old 01-12-2017, 05:56 PM
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Put the idle at between 1500 and 2k rpms when the bike is warm. If it still dies with that idle speed there is a bigger issue at hand. Do you have the top butterfly plates on the throttle bodies? I know on my zx10r when I took them out, it would bog around 5k. Could also check the fuel screen to see if thats clogged. Never hurts to have a clean screen.
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post #7 of 7 Old 01-13-2017, 02:43 PM
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What is the actual idle speed at now?

Charging system output? at idle, just above idle and peak output?
battery fully charged?.certainly not after you cranked it for a while to start...fully charge it and then load test it!

Any codes? FI light?

What exactly did they adjust 500 miles ago?--any written information on what the valves were at and are at now?-anything written on how far off throttle body sync was and what they did to correct this (11 years old......I do not see where you stated mileage.......but--my guess is, the idle air screws to sync the throttle bodies are probably gummed and need to be cleaned to actually synchronize them and they likely did not do that.......nearly every bike I see has this issue)
Not that sync is your problem, it may be a contributor though....and since you paid for a tune up, this certainly should have been done properly
What about the airbox/filter
What about the ignition coils?
What about any of the other dozen electronic sensors that effect running?

What is the general running condition-more than "other than that it runs good"--your idea of good and my idea are likely miles apart....

There are plenty of unanswered questions to answer!!

Stupid people say stupid things on the internet, so be wary of who those people are. If you solicit advice on the internet, just keep in mind 99% of what you'll receive is not based on fact or science-and likely atleast 95% of it is based on bullshit and bravado regurgitated from some other schlub who also did not experience any of what they claim and are also full of shit. If you don't like my bluntness- too bad. I am not here to please you, so move along, your approval is not desired nor is it needed. So before opening your pie hole and adding more stupidity, perhaps sit back, listen, absorb and learn something. You know that saying, it is better to remain silent and thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt!
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